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Anne Applebaum on Trump's betrayal of Europe
"They’re bewildered we’ve allowed this to happen."
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Last month’s Davos World Economic Forum will be remembered primarily for two things: Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney’s historic speech about the end of Pax Americana, and then President Trump making Carney’s point the next day by sounding like a fascist dictator with a concussion while he threatened our Western allies over Greenland.
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Although Trump quickly TACO’d and tried to smooth things over, his speech was the latest indication that Europe needs to rethink its security alliances. America is not only unreliable, but we’ll be governed foreseeably an aspiring dictator who if he could would happily divide the world up into authoritarian spheres of influence, with Europe left to be preyed upon by Putin.
So as a weekend bonus for subscribers, we connected with Anne Applebaum, a Pulitzer Prize-winning historian and staff writer for The Atlantic, to discuss Europe’s perspective on Trump’s unhinged showing at Davos and his broader betrayal of our democratic allies. (Applebaum has a front row seat to these developments — she’s based out of Poland these days.)
“Trump for Europeans conjures up the pre-war era when what we now call populism but then was called fascism engulfed country after country and led to a continent-wide catastrophe that killed millions of people,” she said. “He’s a figure from a previous era they thought was over.”
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“I do think that what Mark Carney said at Davos was something everybody feels, even if they won’t say it,” she added. “We are in a period not of transition but of rupture. Europe will soon be fully responsible for its own security, and we’ll also have to begin thinking much more strategically about how to wield power in the world.”
A full transcript of Applebaum’s conversation with Public Notice contributor Thor Benson, lightly edited for clarity, follows.
Thor Benson
As an American, I’ve gotten used to people downplaying the threat Trump poses, but Europe seems to be taking him very seriously. What do you think explains the difference?
Anne Applebaum
Europeans have changed their attitude. People here were shocked he could win again after January 6, and initially they thought it would be a repeat of Trump 1.0. Leaders were preparing to deal with him the same way they did before, which was a combination of flattery and silence.
But this time the stakes are much higher because of the war in Ukraine. I think the experience of European politicians who have been dealing with him has been that they’re shocked to discover how erratic he is. There are dramatic, radical shifts from one position to the next that we’ve seen over the last year.
He’s literally saying one thing one day, then the direct opposite the next. Now you have tariffs. Now you don’t have tariffs. We support Russia. Now we don’t support Russia. It’s dizzying.
European leaders are taking the threat to invade Greenland very seriously. They’re also taking seriously the idea that he might do business deals with Russia. They see him now as somebody who’s completely unreliable and whose motives make no sense.
But Europeans aren’t living with Trump every day, and they’re not used to what they saw at Davos. They found it bewildering to watch him speak nonsensically for an hour. Americans, by contrast, have normalized him. If you don’t live in Minnesota, maybe you can tune it out.
Thor Benson
Do Europeans think of this more as, “This is a member of NATO, and we have to respond forcefully,” or, “This reminds us of history, and it could get much worse”?
Anne Applebaum...
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